Today’s New York Times has a great article by Stephanie Rosenbloom entitled “Giant Retailers Look to Sun for Energy Savings,” on how green energy is now front and center in the minds of the business sector.
“It’s very clear that green energy is now front and center in the minds of the business sector,” said Daniel M. Kammen, an energy expert at the University of California, Berkeley. “Not only will you see panels on the roofs of your local stores, but I suspect very soon retailers will have stickers in their windows saying, ‘This is a green energy store.’ ”
Here’s the rest of the article:
Giant Retailers Look to Sun for Energy Savings
Vision for Sustainable Ojai: Green Energy Front and Center
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Wow maybe we can have a democracy now !
http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/pelosi-indicates-openness-to-offshore-drilling-vote-2008-08-11.html
Pelosi must really have a tin ear. She’s caving once again to the repugs. The issue of new leases for offshore drilling will not play well in her district in San Francisco. She may be retiring early and the corporate Dems may be getting a very ugly slap in the face when she loses her own seat in Congress to Cindy Sheehan. She made it onto the ballot. Democracy indeed.
Hardly caving into republicans, the majority of the American people are starting to see how by not drilling we are compromising everything from our kids education to future alternative fuels.
Sorry Brian, but your premise is sadly mistaken. Oh I don’t deny that Newt Gingrich’s “Drill Here, Drill Now, Pay Less” lie is fooling some American’s, but I wouldn’t characterize it as a majority, certainly not here in California and definitely not in Pelosi’s district in San Francisco.
If new leases to drill offshore would supposedly help lower the price of gas tomorrow(definitely untrue), why don’t the big five oil companies start drilling on the 63 million acres of offshore oil leases they already have? All new oil leases for the monopoly of oil would do is increase and bolster their stock prices.
Brian, would new leases off California, say in the Monterey Bay, help educate our children? Perhaps it would help educate them that their parents are gullible, greedy and imbecilic.
All new oil leases for the monopoly of oil would do is increase and bolster their stock prices.
Good, my mom owns some energy stocks!
Oh, I forgot Pelosi wants to “save the planet” maybe she’s trying to save her ass before she gets kicked out of office.
Since you obviously know nothing about how the oil business works you also don’t know that that 63 million acres doesn’t have any oil on it, otherwise they’d be pulling oil out of there like crazy at $120 per barrel. When the dems said to the oil companies “use it or lose it” they just laughed and said “fine take back the useless leases”
When families have to decide whether to drive to work or put their kids through college, snide comments from out of touch posie sniffers like yourself doesn’t help them pay their bills. But you probably don’t care about working people anyway.
You can bet that these stores wouldn’t be implementing solar if it weren’t for the fact that it increases their bottomline and U.S> consumerism as at a all time low. This is not an environmental move by htem nor a reflection of their core values. The end result may be desirable yet the motives scream GREEN WASH!
Brian,
Oh, you’d like to talk about leases with oil on them. Okay. I was just talking about the existing 63 million acres of leases offshore. You say there’s no oil there, I seriously doubt that, but according to the Wall Street Journal there are no drilling ships available anyway–so perhaps that’s why the oil monopoly is not interested in drilling tomorrow.
Okay, let’s move to the land then shall/Shell we. How about the Naval Petroleum Reserve in Alaska? Of course, that was it’s former name, in 1923 George W. Bush’s historical twin Warren G. Harding created the Navel Petroleum Reserve in Alaska designating it Naval Petroleum Reserve Number 4. In 1976, the name was changed to the National Petroleum Reserve in Alaska(NPR-A). The overall area of the NPR-A is 23.5 million acres. Good old Bill Clinton made a little over 20 million acres of this pristine wilderness eligible for lease to the oil monopoly in 1998. Apparently to assuage his guilt, he bumped up the designations of several National Monuments in the lower 48 to National Park status, like Joshua Tree.
Anyway, much bullshit has been spewed by Gingrich on behalf of his greedy masters in the oil monopoly about not being able to drill in the Alaska National Wildlife refuge(ANWR). Well, ANWR is due East of the NPR-A and is about 18 million acres in size. In 1998 Bill Clinton made an area of land larger than all of ANWR open and drillable for lease. The NPR-A land is separated by ANWR by an imaginary line and it is pretty much as pristine as ANWR. That is Ex(xon-Mobil)cept for the land that was leased to the oil monopoly by Bill. The oil Monopoly did march right in there and actually tap wells and they discovered that as much as 13 billion barrels of oil are economically recoverable under our land that they leased if oil could be sold at $26 per barrel or more.
Now according to your superior wisdom in the oil business Brian, you would think the oil monopoly would “be pulling oil out of there like crazy at $120 per barrel.” Especially BPcause the 13 BBO figure was based on projections of $26 per barrel. Nope. Con(ocoPhillips)-trary to your simple free market illusions, the oil monopoly capped the wells and they are simply sitting on the leases. Oh, and they’re whining about not being able to drill over in ANWR all the while. Why? Because the projections were based on $26 per barrel oil. They know if they wait and sit, the value stays on their books as an asset buoying their stock prices and they can drill later at an even higher price. “Since (I)you obviously know nothing about how the oil business works” I can only imagine that they are deliberately screwing the American public for their own venal gain.
ChevrOnto your assertion that I don’t care about working people. Just who do you think I am? I’m the sole breadwinner in my family, though my wife works harder than I do raising our son. Like many people in Ojai I have to commute, though few pull my 750 miles a week. I’m sorry if I seem snide to you but this issue really pisses me off, especially when Presidential nominees bow to the yoke of the oil monopoly and pretend the “Drill Here, Drill Now, Pay Less” is anything other than pure BULLSHIT! Quit frankly Brian, It saddens me that you think oil is the height of our achievements on this planet. Art, Literature, Architecture, Engineering, Drama, Science, Music, Love and even beekeeping ALL existed before oil.
Ooops. My links didn’t post. Here they are:
“so perhaps that’s why the oil monopoly is not interested in drilling tomorrow.”
“The oil Monopoly did march right in there and actually tap wells and they discovered that as much as 13 billion barrels of oil are economically recoverable under our land that they leased if oil could be sold at $26 per barrel or more.”
If you hate oil so much why don’t you use something else. Wait, don’t tell me, the oil comapnies bought up all the patents on all the other alternative fuels, and all the patents on the super duper batteries.
Sheesh, you called SPK to the mat, saying he “obviously know[s] nothing about how the oil business works”. He called your bluff, and your “hate” reply is the best you have?
If you love oil so much, why don’t you marry it?
Called my bluff?
With what? Nonsense?
This brings to mind a great George Carlin skit about stuff. He said, you ever notice how everyone else’s stuff is shit and your shit is stuff? Get that shit off the dresser and let me put my stuff down!
So if you think your shit is stuff, and SPK’s stuff is shit, show him where he’s wrong. You say “they’d be pulling oil out of there like crazy at $120 per barrel” and he tells you why they aren’t.
Go ahead, back up your shit, Brian. Calling it nonsense, and playing the hate card simply doesn’t count. Taking a talking point from Fox News or Rush doesn’t count either.
Yeah Brian. A simple touche’ would suffice.
Ok, sorry I’m so dense, honestly I can’t make any sense out of what you have written. Could you please try to explain it to me in another way or more clearly. Why is it that if we drill more oil and add additional oil to the world market that that will not bring down the global price of oil?
Dear Friends,
As I have counselled in the past, Brian uses just enough fact and logic in his comments to seduce you into thinking that he can be reached through rational means. Sadly, he cannot. The opinions you see him express are merely surface manifestations of deep underlying assumptions that you will never see fully exposed and that you cannot reach with your good arguments.
I have speculated that his underlying assumptions are rooted in fundamentalist Christian theology, but they may have other sources. In any case, in arguing with Brian, you are tilting at windmills. (Not that there’s anything wrong with tilting at windmills, provided you realize that’s what you’re doing!)
If you love oil so much, why don’t you marry it?
Oh, Tyler…you di-int!
But on everything else, you rock!
As I have counselled in the past, Brian uses just enough fact and logic in his comments to seduce you into thinking that he can be reached through rational means. Sadly, he cannot.
A-frikkin’-men.
Here is the truth about ANWAR, which I have posted before, but as usual facts don’t seem to stand in the way of the stone age mentality of the left.
http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2008/06/i-received-this.html
Your link, to a right wing blog, says nothing about quantity or timing of production.
According to the Bush Administration’s Department of Energy: “The opening of ANWR is projected to have its largest oil price reduction impacts as follows: a reduction in low-sulfur, light crude oil prices of $0.41 per barrel (2006 dollars) in 2026 for the low oil resource case, $0.75 per barrel in 2025 for the mean oil resource case, and $1.44 per barrel in 2027 for the high oil resource case”
http://www.eia.doe.gov/oiaf/servicerpt/anwr/pdf/sroiaf(2008)03.pdf
At 42 gallons to the barrel, BEST case scenario would lower gas prices 3.4 cents in 19 years. What was your point?
It took a little digging, but I finally found a description of the lady Brian cites as an authority on oil in Anwar. What follows is from a website called jezebel.com. It points out that Pamela Geller, author of the blog that Brian cites, believes that feminism is of a piece with Marxist-Leninist propaganda, and that Obama is a tool of Colombian drug cartels. This is the caliber of authority that Brian turns to for his views about energy policy.
Anyway, this is what jezebel.com has to say about Pamela Geller, Brian’s chosen authority on drilling for oil in Alaska:
We are not going to beat around the, uh, pubes: we did not really dive into a piece on “5 Female Conservative Bloggers” expecting to find new role models/heroines for Jezebel readers to admire/encourage/etc.. But HOLY SHIT, how did we never hear of Pamela Geller? Pamela’s blog is called Atlas Shrugs. She has an MBA. “I’m not a feminist, I’m an anti-feminist,” she tells Right Wing News.”That whole movement…is rooted in Marxist-Leninist propaganda.” Today’s post is basically about how Barack Obama is the tool of Colombian paramilitary drug cartels, Hugo Chavez and Al Qaeda. (Wait, actually, every post is about that.) But her big claim to internet fame came when she posted a video blog entry while wearing a bikini back in the summer of ’06. See, she was in Israel, and she felt it was important to illustrate the fact that although the scrappy little underfunded self-defense outfit of Israel was in the throes of a bloody war with a colossal superhuman enemy no mortal thought they could ever beat, she wasn’t yet being forced to don a burka.
No credibility problems with Ayn Rand or the people who worship her. Nope. None at all.
Ever since Bush started just talking about drilling the price has dropped by like $20 dollars a barrel or something. Are you all disappointed every time the price drops? It’s called supply and demand, pretty straight forward.
Instead of whining about how evil oil is why aren’t you folks out there investing in solar panels or wind energy?
An ad hominem argument, also known as argumentum ad hominem (Latin: “argument to the man”, “argument against the man”) consists of replying to an argument or factual claim by attacking or appealing to a characteristic or belief of the person making the argument or claim, rather than by addressing the substance of the argument or producing evidence against the claim.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem
An ad hominem argument, also known as argumentum ad hominem (Latin: “argument to the man”, “argument against the man”) consists of replying to an argument or factual claim by attacking or appealing to a characteristic or belief of the person making the argument or claim, rather than by addressing the substance of the argument or producing evidence against the claim.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem
Aww, gee thanks, Brian!
How incredibly coincidental, though. Last night, the despicable Jerome Corsi gave TV viewers a lesson on the definition of ad hominem. Twice! So, back to Education-by-Fox TV for you, Bub. I’m sure we all can’t wait for your next enlightening Show-and-Tell.
Oh, and…psssst! As evidenced by those we Dems put up as candidates for President of the United States (as compared, for example, to the complete lack of brain power between the ears of your guys), people in OUR party are pretty intelligent and well educated. Soooo, I would take a guess and say that many( if not most) of us learned (and retained) the term from high school and college. And from reading (gasp!) REAL books, by REAL investigative journalists who are actually able to SOURCE PROPERLY. You know, the kind of books that go to #1 LEGITIMATELY (as opposed to having deep-pocketed donors who buy up the entire inventory). But don’t feel too bad – we all know how hard you try. And that, uh…counts…for… something, I guess.
Brian,
An ad hominem argument is when I challenge your opinions by attacking you personally. If I said, “Your views are idiotic because your grandfather was Atilla the Hun,” that would be ad hominem.
But to challenge the intellectual credentials of a person on a matter that requires informed expertise is entirely different. That is something commonly done every day in courtrooms, job interviews, and every other walk of life.
Your citing of Pamela Geller as an authority on oil in Alaska reminds me of the guy you relied on for your views on global warming. You remember the one, don’t you? His credentials to reject the scientific consensus on climate change were his Master’s Degree in Engineering from Linkoping Institute of Technology.
But referencing bikini-clad blogger Pamela Geller as an authority on energy policy represents a new low even for you.
These exchanges with Brian are absolutely riveting!
That’s funny, I was ignored regarding my ANWR comment (#19)…
At 42 gallons to the barrel, BEST case scenario would lower gas prices 3.4 cents in 19 years.
phaloarope…I would think you would be a huge Ayn Rand fan. She was an atheist and had no problems with abortion. Being consistent, she also wanted to keep YOUR hands off of her stuff. That the part you don’t like.
Brian…how do you stand it in here?
As I pointed out above. If they want to drill so bad, how about drilling in the over 20 million acres of the National Petroleum Reserve – Alaska(NPR-A) where there is more than 13BBO that are proven. The oil companies shouldn’t even be allowed to utter the acronym ANWR until they start drilling on their already leased land.
Mr LOONEY, I’ve often wondered why Brian hangs here. Personally I’m glad he does. He makes a perfect foil and some of the things he writes are right on, not just right wing. I suspect that Brian likes it here because occasionally there is a higher level of discourse that is informative and we try to keep it civil. From your own comments, I can see that you are not truly interested in the subject at hand. You appear to be interested only in lame-assed, Us versus Them, red/blue fights. Good luck with that.
Eloquent as usual, spk.
But since you brought it up, I will note that you missed the point. It isn’t always us/them red/blue and Ayn Rand is a perfect example. And I didn’t bring her name into the conversation.
phaloarope…I would think you would be a huge Ayn Rand fan. She was an atheist and had no problems with abortion. Being consistent, she also wanted to keep YOUR hands off of her stuff. That the part you don’t like.
For a person who doesn’t know me, you make a lot of assumptions, George. Shall I return the favor and make the assumption that you and Mark Foley are soulmates? Seems fair, based on what I perceive to be your political bias.
Brian is an integral part of this site, in my opinion. I can’t speak for him but I have a sneaking suspicion that he delightfully REVELS in getting under “our” skin. Whaddaya say, Brian? Is that true?
LTOR,
I try my best !
Well then, you get an A+ in that department!
EVERYBODY knows you, phal. But I have no reason to equate you with Mark Foley.
I had to look up ‘phalarope’ on Wikipedia. It says there are two kinds, the Red Phalarope and the Red-Necked Phalarope. I was beginning to worry about giving you this information, afraid you would get kicked out of the club. But then I read that the Red Phalarope was also known as the Grey Phalarope – in Europe.
Perfect.
EVERYBODY knows you, phal.
Then you know when and where I’ll be having coffee tomorrow. Feel free to stop by.
I was beginning to worry about giving you this information, afraid you would get kicked out of the club.
Your concern is touching. I’ll put you on my Christmas card list.
BTW, there’s another Phalarope: Wilson’s. Like most right-wingers, your research never seems to take you all the way to the end of the available material.
But enough about me; let’s edge back toward the main theme of this thread: What do you do in order to keep from being a complete and total drag on the environment upon which you depend for your very life?
Phalorope,
Are you going to put looney bird in a UFC kamoora when you see him next? Or just sit on him? This most exciting!!
Sorry about missing the coffee date – this work thing is a drag.
Are Rutting Bucks in season?. You know us bitter clingers – we don’t wrestle. We pack.
OK, to get back to the issue. Let’s see: We have a blue recycle can, it gets picked up every other week. I re-use plastic water bottles to the extent possible. I don’t litter.
I don’t mind being such a good conservationist. Makes me feel better about driving my Suburban (required for work) and my 150 mph sports car.
I think I may have just tumbled to Phalarope’s identity. If I’m right, I’m not all that surprised, just pleased.
Anyway, back to oil. Specifically resource wars. Like the first and second oil wars in Iraq in 1991 and 2003 to now, the fighting in Georgia is all about energy. Worse then that, it appears that the President of Georgia was goaded into attacking the Russian enclaves on their shared boarder by elements in the neo-con camp around the Vice President and the McCain campaign. The attack by Georgia was akin to a pomeranian attacking a rottweiler–suicide. The only reason he would have done this is because he was convinced to do it by us and assured that he would have backup.
Lately the McCain campaign has wondered away from his pledge to have a respectful campaign, even calling Obama the Antichrist in coded language in one ad. Also, there is talk that Karl Rove has taken over the McSame campaign which accounts for the dramatic shift in strategy. An interesting side bar to all this is that, about a month ago when Karl Rove was subpoenaed by Congress and he refused to show up, his lawyer said he was out of the country. Turns out he was vacationing…in Georgia. Hmmmm.
I think I may have just tumbled to Phalarope’s identity.
May it cause you neither distress nor consternation when you discover that you’re wrong.
I think I may have just tumbled to Phalarope’s identity.
May it cause you neither distress nor consternation when you discover that you’re wrong.
We lived in Ojai for a little over a year. We have just moved to the Green State of Oregon and I am truly inspired… We spent a few days in Portland before settling in to our chosen home of Eugene and I can easily say that I feel Eugene (and Oregon for that matter) is excelling in the Peaceful green revolution…!It is exciting and a bit intimidating to finally be an underdog in the pursuit of living clean….I finally feel like I live in a place where I have so much to learn about truly settling in to a more green/sustainable lifestyle. So much inspiration! I am not trying to sound harsh or come across as holier than thou but Ojai it is time to truly wake up to the beauty of the climate where you live and the awesomeness of the potential of the community. ENJOY!
Green in Oregon:
could you be specific and tell us at least one thing you are learning that might possibly apply here.
By the way, we’ll probably welcome you back when you get tired of the rain up there
Where shall I begin? I have lived in several so-called progressive towns before living in Eugene and I must say that Eugene is the most progressive place that I have lived and visited oustide of Europe. There are many things that I am learning here that could apply to the Ojai community. First of all, people commuting/transportation via bicycle is HUGE here. There are bike paths and most roads have a bike lane. I did bike and see people biking in Ojai but not in the same capacity as in Eugene. I mean bikes have a MAJOR presence here!!! I have several awesome food co-ops that I can go to and they have GREAT prices and selection/variety. Where is the co-op in Ojai? It is stunning that Ojai does not have a co-op. Rainbow Bridge and Farmer and the Cook just rake in the profits and pass little on to the community. Ojai deserves better! I see more people taking there own bags to the grocery store in Eugene. I enjoyed living in Ojai. I am inspired by the green/sustainable/peace movement in Eugene. It is definately a model Green town.Ojai is Great but there is much room for improvement. My family and I would much rather weather Global Warming in this environment than in dry arid and hot conditions.
Green in Oregon, thank you for sharing your observations about Eugene. I had the same impressions when I visited there about ten years ago.
Ojai has the potential to be as bicycle/pedestrian friendly as Eugene and other model cities around the world. Everywhere I went I saw people of all ages, including those in their 70′s, 80′s and older, actually using bicycles as alternative transportation, not just for recreation. When I saw the Valet Bicycle Parking with acres of bicycles at major events, it felt like I was back in Amsterdam.
At the time, there was a famous Human Powered Transportation Center (not sure of the name) that offered bicycle education programs for school-age youngsters. A Eugene planner/author named Eben Fodor wrote a book called “Bigger, Not Better,” (which I must review sometime here on the Post). (I gave a copy to the Ojai City Manager.)
The bus station where we waited to go to the Country Fair was like this wonderful, clean, well-kept courtyard area where you could read and relax…you did not feel like a second-class citizen waiting for the bus!
WHOOPS! I reversed the words in the title of the book in the above Post!
“Better, Not Bigger: How to Take Control of Urban Growth and Improve Your Community,”
http://www.fodorandassociates.com/Docs/writing_by_ef.htm