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Maybe she was talking about "water guns".
It is kinda warm outside.

LOL. Yep - that's a good one!

I am quite sure that back in the days when I had two boys under ten and other children of all ages running through the house playing with guns ranging from homemade wooden pretend guns, to water pistols to toy guns given to them by friends and relatives even though I opposed such "toys", I myself felt like shooting them!

Don't bring your guns to town son

I was not in a very good mood until I read Heather's piece and the subsequent posts. I'm chuckling now. Thanks, everyone.

As a kid, My friends and I would play army, cowboys and Indians until we were dead tired of playing dead. Not one of my friends turned out homicidal or violent later on in life. But this is a different era now. With all the diversions one can allow their kids to occupy themselves, and I'm referring to those tasks that are not tasking the brain, not building friendships, allowing an allusion of contact with the world around but really taking these young, impressionable minds, to places one not ought to be at that age, for that matter, at any age.

Many of the notorious crimes committed by youth, were not kids who played cops and robbers, cowboys and Indians in their back yards. These kids played video games of violence, over and over and over reliving the thrill until, they had become numb and desensitized to all normal sense of revulsion to exacting such pain. The thrill goes away in time, so some of these youths who's parents held not their hands back when they had ought to have, seek the thrill by trading in the joystick for the real, against real targets.

No, not all players of violent video games become stalkers and killers. But many of these notorious killers were constant players of violent video games.

Our society keeps providing means to alienate our kids from us and each other. Not that is the aim, it's simply the result if left unattended, unchecked. Parents that don't allow video games, and limit tv, have a closer relationship with there kids, and the kids are industrious enough to find ways to spend time, without disconnecting from mom and dad and their siblings and their friends, still managing to have a good time.

Part of developing and maintaining a healthy mental balance of one's self, is the feed back you get when in play, work, from your playmates, counterparts, colleagues who call you on a foul, a misstep, inappropriate behaviour. In the flesh, you must sort it out at that moment. You are on notice by your peers. This is healthy development. Your children will never get this from a video game, from a computer.

So I tend to go easy on that mother mentioned above, if the kids are in deed outside, being physical, arguing as they should. But if they are in doors, not cussing, not talking, not being talked to, then get worried, too much is going on in those little heads without appropriate feedback from family and peers.

very well stated, Dana...a very stimulating addition to the discussion!

this is a topic of great interest for me, and was long before i knew i was to be a father (two months to go, by the way!). Dana's right, or at least in step with the most current research, that video games are a far stronger influence than other types of violent entertainment such as movies. the reason for this is that video games are interactive -- YOU are actually the one DOING the shooting, the stabbing, the breaking, the raping (YES, there are video games where rape is an allowable and rewardable activity in the game). further, violent experiences at the level of depth and reality that movies and video games are approaching are stored in the same part of the brain as they would be if those experiences actually happened to you. video games (and most other violent toys) also encourage a non-creative "us and them" framework for all interactions and conflicts, in which the "them" is always wrong, and always must be destroyed. researchers are saying that a developing brain that's exposed to these scenarios can be programmed to see their world in these black-and-white terms. there's loads of research on the website of the one man who seems to be doing most of it: Craig A. Anderson, PhD.

Heather's initial question is a good one: what are we REALLY saying? what are our children's toys teaching them? according to some, a healthy toy is one that
• helps children work out their own ideas and experiences
• teaches about relationships between objects
• encourages creative self-expression
• promotes a healthy body and coordination
• promotes social interaction
• encourages taking turns and cooperation

can some of these tasks be accomplished with violent toys? YES. can they ALSO be accomplished with nonviolent toys? OF COURSE. for me, the violent toys that teach those skills are like lead paint: WHY would i use it when i have non-deadly alternatives? Teachers Resisting Unhealthy Children's Entertainment (TRUCE) is another great resource for postive actions that parents, other adults, and communities can take to encourage playtime that's supportive of healthy minds and behaviors.

no, we're not all going to be psycho-killers because we played cowboys-and-indians, but as a favorite slogan of the safety and sanity group Beyond War goes, "The Means are the Ends in the Making." in other words, how we play prepares us for how we live...that's why people give baby dolls to little girls: we expect them to be nurturing and eventually be good mothers. we (society) then turn around and give little boys toy guns and camouflaged Hummers, and then wonder why they solve problems by fighting. Do we wonder though, REALLY?

When I was a child I had a toy cap pistol with a holster and then when I was around 10 yrs. old my father gave me a 22 caliber toy pistol but it shot blanks so it sounded real. Then soon after that I was given a pellet air rifle and cross bow which was a lot of fun to shoot targets with. I was never told not to shoot animals or cars or people, I just didn't and believe me I had plenty of nager inside of me, but I didn't act out with the weapons, I acted out by punching holes in or kicking the doors. This anger was repressed in the family system and the collective and there were no alternatives presented to learn communication that would release the emotional wounds. The toys and then semi-real weapons,as far as I can tell, had no detrimental affect on me or made me more violent or conditioned by the patriarchy. What affected me most and caused me to embrace a non-violent, pro-peace ethic was seeing my neighbors come home in body bags from Vietnam and the sadness I felt about useless death and destruction. This all took place prior to me attending junior high, or 7th grade and if it weren't for the mentors in my life, given my neighborhood, I could have easily found myself in gang activity the business of street drugs. Not sure where I'm going with this. Maybe simply a story about the importance of guides and mentors and the innocence of childhood and social play as a positive and natural aspect of humanity. Maybe, as adults, we micro-manage and project onto children concerns that are more about our own fears than the child's experience.

Quote from Terminator 2: Judgement Day: As 2 boys run around with guns, pretend shooting, while saying "I got you! NO! I shot you! NO I DID!" "We're not going to make it, are we? You know...humans..." Arnold says.."It is in your nature to destroy yourselves." "Ya, real bummer, huh?"

There is certainly some truth to that quote. Equally true, though, is that some people are builders, peace makers, organizers to affect change for the good of mankind. All this, in spite of their days of play with toy guns. My point in my above post, is that we must have our children in play with others to bend their personalities towards a maturer understanding of themselves, their place among others, responsibilities towards others as in family, friends and again, themselves.

When Raymond spoke of his anger, and the repression at home or in the family, how he dealt with it, is an illustration of the need to have on going contact with others, to share, to bounce off those disproportionate/unbalanced emotions that we all have gone through. That is why sports are so important. When you are among your peers, competing, sharing knowledge of the game or activity, opportunities inevitably come up to take those relations beyond the contrived activity. To interpersonal relations, where one and others can openly confront the trials in their lives, and get the feedback that is ever so important.

In that equation, are the coaches, who are keener than the average person to notice something is wrong or when one of his charges is having problems. I can remember Coaches Vale, Smith, Olsen and others at Nordhoff who were superb at what they did. Many boys benefited by their mentoring. I'm sure Coach Vale thought I was hopeless, but I remember his reaching out when no one else in my life did. He was an important part of my development, whether he could see it or not.

Part of all this interaction is disciplining your child. Leaving kids to their own devises leads them to vices. Kids need limitations, internally, they crave it. Children don't like confusion, or a wishy washy approach to their being disciplined. Children think in Black and White. They don't like over explanations as to why they are being punished or put off of something. Keep it short and to the point, they respect that, even if they don't see it your way. Also it makes it easier for future corrections.

evan says: "further, violent experiences at the level of depth and reality that movies and video games are approaching are stored in the same part of the brain as they would be if those experiences actually happened to you."

I've always had trouble with thrillers and horror movies, particularly movies with stalkers. I feel like it is happening to me. I wonder why some people feel the thrill of the chase, as it were, and some people feel like they've been chased down.

That's a good question. I do like a good scary movie but, not one that's built around sadistic or gratuitous violence. What Evan shared, concerning the storage of these images in a place of the mind as actual events are, in one's life, affects the thinking of that one. Not necessarily always to the detriment of behaviour by the same. But I've spoken with several people who seem to have a disconnect with reality, who exposed themselves to a constant feed of what I consider negative nurturing. I can't site a source nor a statistic, but many of the men who engage in sexual violence are avid consumers of pornography. Again, to qualify, not all consumers of such are out there plotting, exploiting, moving against other individuals, but the one's that are, in great numbers are found to have been feeding, re-enforcing a mental image, by way of pornography.

The old saying, "What you eat is what you are", is appro po in this context as well. What you feed the brain becomes the reality of your thoughts, as twisted as it may be. ?OR?

Or you take a positive stand for yourself and those around you, bringing positive readings, physical activities, group efforts, or encourage relationships with others that are positive in their approach to life.

My daughter is quite sweet, but shy. I have to push, nudge, encourage her to make phone calls to her friends I find are positive influences. One of my techniques was, when I'm picking her up from school, she might be talking to one of those friends, I'll suggest in front of both of them to exchange numbers, and make a commitment to call that night. It works, and she is grateful, though embarrassed, by her dad's butting in. As parents, or as in Evan's case, parents to be, we are the tether to the life that surrounds our children. It is on us to fetter those images, people, that are harmful to them. Just as important, it is on us to allow, bring in, encourage, support those images, people who are good for them.